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AVB and Chelsea


Since the recent results for Chelsea haven't been good, there are a lot of comments in WAGNH forums that are calling for AVB sacking. But I have some objections to this line of thinking and want to find out why you guys think so.

Star-divide

The most important point to be considered is who is going to replace AVB. The managers who have had success with Chelsea recently are Mourinho, Hiddink and Ancelotti. None of these 3 are available now. I have seen suggestions for bringing in Benitez or Van Gaal but I think we can all agree that there is no proof to suggest that either of these 2 is suited for Chelsea. I would have even considered options closer to EPL such as Swansea or Norwich managers but none of you seem to be looking at these two.

The next important thing to look at is a long term approach. Getting the best out of the golden era players is important but at the same time we should remember that all these players are now in the wrong side of 30. Personally I have wondered why people think Lampard and Drogba can't go on like Giggs and Scholes. But after watching them play this season, you can see that their performances are dropping. We can add Ashely Cole also to this list. Also I can notice that the younger guys such as Mata, Luiz, Ramires and even Sturridge, to a certain extent, don't seem to have any problems with AVB. So if the older guys whose quality has decreased have a problem with AVB then I would rather take AVB's side. That doesn't mean I am not grateful to these players, but they should also realize that the club needs to find replacements for them and their playing time will decrease. AVB has brought in players like Mata and Romeu and I have faith that he will bring in more such players.

There are some mistakes, I agree such as the continued use of Meireles and Bosingwa. But I want to discuss some points reagarding this. Bosingwa started this season well with a goal and assists and he also has more pace than Ivanovic. Also in recent weeks JT hasn't been available and AVB might have actually chosen between Cahill at CB and Bosingwa at RB rather than choosing between Bosingwa and Ivanovic for RB. Now that AVB seems to trust Cahill I think we will see lesser of Bosingwa. Between Meireles and Lampard, recent performances have severely dented Meireles' case. But at the same time we have to remember that Lampard's main contributions this season have been scoring goals and if we play him in a double pivot, he will have to restrain himself from running forward or he will have to sprint back to defend if we lose posession. At this age I think Lampard can't rush back and he will have to be used intelligently. But now that we have seen that Meireles sucks in tackling and defending I believe AVB will rather use Essien or Mikel there instead of Meireles.

I am not a AVB apologist actually and Chelsea's interests come before AVB's interests to me. But I believe it is in Chelsea's best interests now to stick to AVB. What do you all think?

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Of course stick with him

But I wonder if Roman understands the virtue of patience.
AVB’s selection has been sometimes questionable, like the latest one being picking Meireles when he has Essien and Lampard at his disposal.
We are too used to winning recently, therefore the call for his head. He needs to learn his game more and gain more experience.
He needs to win. NEED.

by Marcus_Cfc on Feb 22, 2012 11:15 AM GMT via Android app reply actions  

The reality is that he has three year contract and some of the fans have the same mindset as roman, if they don't get results right away they want to move on whith another coach.

AVB is learning on the job but at least he is willing to stick it through , he is still learning about the competition in barclays, how to handle the media, and the pamper geriatrics we have. In AVB i trust

Everybody stutters one way or the other
So check out my message to you.
As a matter of fact don't let nothin' hold you back.
If the Scatman can do it brother so can you.
Yo I'm the Scatman.

by Habana on Feb 22, 2012 2:34 PM GMT reply actions  

Stick with AVB

And let him buy his side, it should be ready to compete long-term in two seasons

by theRamster on Feb 22, 2012 11:28 PM GMT reply actions  

Time

I think AVB needs to be given time, to mould his own side, to learn the EPL and media and time for Chelsea. We, as the club, needs stability and to create a system based on youth development rather than quick fixes that cost a lot of money to maintain. For the first time in the RA era things are not going Chelsea’s way and RA and the fans need to stop this knee jerk reaction of scrapping things if they do not work instantly. Patience and stability will be the key to a long and successful CFC.

Through the ups and the downs, in Chelsea I trust.

by ChelseaPIE on Feb 23, 2012 10:56 AM GMT reply actions  

AVB

I have been calling for his head. There are many reasons why i think his dismissal would be a good thing, but every time I articulate them I am met with reasonable objection and arguments speaking to the reasons he should stay, none have been “He must stay because he is a good coach”, most of the reasons are, “He needs time to mold the time in his image”…to that I say given the microcosm that this season serves for the long term, is his the image we want to mold the team into. I don’t know but that is just my opinion. Others say “If we fire him, a new coach won’t make a difference especially mid season.” Again a very reasonable assertion, but a heavy misconception; reason being, Scolari was fired, Guus came in, there was no transitional period, there was no lull, the team went on a tear which culminated in us winning the FA Cup and being cheated out of a Finals spot by Ovrebro. Also consider Martin O Niel at Sunderland, when Bruce was booted out he took over and turned things around, Sunderland is doing decently now with no significant change in player personnel. The most significant reason though is “We need to stop this player power, how many managers will the players get rid of before we realize they are the common denominator.” Again top of the class kind of thinking there but alas the statement is somewhat amiss methinks; Yes Chelsea, since Roman took over, have been the revolving door for managers and a home for the key players. But wait, let us do an analysis. Ranieri was fired, he came second and Roman felt it was not good enough and wanted more glamour, there was no player-manager strife there. Mourinho came in he was fired for thinking that he could assert himself to an oligarch, he got fired for not being subordinate enough. I somewhat blame the owner (although if I were him I also would not tolerate insolence, especially when I am the kinda person that is buddy buddy with Putin) there coz the players were reportedly crying over the loss of their leader. Grant was a stop gap, Hiddink was beloved but had other engagements, and a lot of the players including the old guard really like(d) Carlo, who wouldn’t the consummate gentleman that he is, there was no player-manager strife there. So who was it that the player power got rid of???? Scolari! and I challenge anyone on here to counter my statement when I say good riddance with regards to Scolari, he was not that good a coach in club circumstances, though a master of it at National level, he just could not adjust, I mean he benched Drogba in his prime and was having constant run ins with key players such as Ballack. So in essence, the only managers that there actually has been a public revolt against from key players are AVB and Scolari, we know how Scolari was, I think I can glean from that that AVB may just need the boot as well. I mean think about it this way, players know more about the game than us the fans, they know a quality coach when they see one, I do not think they see one when looking at AVB.

by GianfrancoZola on Feb 23, 2012 3:38 PM GMT reply actions  

Thanks for the detailed reply

This is exactly what I wanted to discuss. I can agree with you when you say that nothing AVB has done so far at Chelsea suggests he is good for us. What I mean is – AVB’s success against good teams has only been in 2 games – man city and Valencia. But in both these games we were like sitting deep and counter attacking – not what AVB has in mind. But what you should also consider is that our players who excel at this counter attacking style are all old now. We anyways have to rebuild and when doing so, why not change our style too. Also AVB has won the trouble at Porto and its not like he just repeated whatever the previous manager had done. He has given a new identity to Porto and while they lost heavily to city yesterday, some of their passing play was amazing to watch. We currently don’t have the midfield to press continuously or to make clever passes. I mean as good as Ramires looks, it is mainly his pace and stamina and not his tackling or passing that has stood out. Even Mata isn’t a good tackler but he is our best passer. If Essien can reach his form of the golden days and we get a hard working creative player like Modric then we will be able to play more in AVB style

by Uchiha Sasuke on Feb 23, 2012 5:38 PM GMT reply actions  

Regarding Gian's 2nd point

Players don’t see a quality coach in AVB – well our future stars in the current team are Luiz, Mata, Sturridge and Ramires and none of them have expressed any doubts about AVB. Even Drogba has been saying positive comments. My guess is the players who have lost faith in him are Lampard, Malouda, Ashley and maybe Mikel. But all these guys have a secondary reason too to get rid of AVB. He isn’t playing 3 of these players regularly and Ashley knows AVB is trying to get Perreira from Porto. I don’t see any of these players as long term solutions for us and if I had to choose between them or AVB I will most likely take AVB’s side. Lampard is a Chelsea legend and I admire him hugely but his style of play is very unique and we aren’t likely to find midfielders like him in the future. So if his time is up I will be sad to see him leave but feel it is better for the club.

by Uchiha Sasuke on Feb 23, 2012 5:47 PM GMT up reply actions  

correction

AVB has won the treble at Porto – not the trouble :)

by Uchiha Sasuke on Feb 23, 2012 5:50 PM GMT up reply actions  

Gianfranco

Youve certainly ‘articulated’ on why AVB should be sacked but youve given nothing as a solution. if you were to sack him, who would be your appointment? and give a response that is an actual reality (not brendan rogers).

by Josh Cutter on Feb 23, 2012 6:09 PM GMT reply actions  

I would have liked to see Martin O Neill as manager!

Bit late now since he is at Sunderland but the guy seems to do brilliantly with every team he manages and I don’t know why he hasn’t landed a really big job yet. His teams are always very enthusiastic, he gets the best out of players and gives them lots of self belief- not unlike Mourinho in that way. His teams also play entertaining football. Would be interesting to see what he would be like at a big club with money to spend!Moyes would be another manager I would like to see given a shot at a big club-like O Neill a good manager but I guess you will never know what they are like at big clubs until they are given a go, they could flop like Roy Hodgeson!

by conorjmartin on Feb 27, 2012 12:34 AM GMT up reply actions  

I'

Tor ilisar'thera'nal!

by Maiev on Feb 28, 2012 10:27 PM GMT up reply actions  

Reply fail - sorry

That’s an idea I’d certainly entertain – I would also love to see O’Neill at Chelsea, and I’m somewhat sad to see him at Sunderland (and doing well there, seemingly). And regarding the flop – any manager could flop. I’m not sure if that would necessarily speak against O’Neill – though of course you could say since he never managed a club like Chelsea he would lack experience in that regard and we never found out how good he would did at a big club, certainly

Tor ilisar'thera'nal!

by Maiev on Feb 28, 2012 10:29 PM GMT up reply actions  

I Agree

Although many people are saying that AVB must be given time, I think that today’s utterly pathetic performance is enough to cement and justify his sacking. In my mind, any coach who doesn’t earn the acceptance of the Old Guard is probably deserving. If JT, Lamps and Drogba don’t support the coach then what reason should the fans have. I agree with your statement that the players understand coaches better than the fans. Also, AVB has always been considered a Man Manager, he is currently failing in that role. Lastly, AVB’s tactical failures has proven that Chelsea teams have and should be known for “parking the bus,” no slow useless build-up which is often cut-out before any signifcant progress anyway

by spike70111 on Mar 4, 2012 5:08 AM GMT reply actions  

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